I just got back from a guided trip on the lower Sac and have been thoughtful about the entire experience since. My friend and I caught big fish, but it somehow felt unsatisfying. At one point we were fishing the "Whorehouse" riffle and at that point it hit me that a guided trip is something like going to a whorehouse (honestly, I've never been to one, so maybe it's great ). The guide drifts down the river in the best spots and all you have to do is mend your line occassionally and set the hook. It's close to a sure thing. The guide was excellent at managing the boat and directing us to the best spots. He took most of the difficulty out of fishing. I enjoyed the trip overall, but still have questions about a spoonfed fishing experience.
I'm not denegrating guides or anyone that loves this kind of experience. There are many different kinds of people and each of us has his/her way of looking at things. I've only had a guide 4 times and the other 3 times I was learning how to fly fish years ago. This time I felt like an experienced fisherman cheating my way to big fish.
I think it is a great time on the Lower Sac!! Some guides are better than others, but if you are out fishing with Ryan Johnston he will put you on the fish!! He jokes around and has made plenty of funny shouts and noises, just like some of your other fishing buddies!! His favorite shout is settttt!!! I was pretty skeptical about guides, but Ryan will row you down some of the lesser known areas. Most of the trips you will only see one other boat and be landing around 40-50 fish. I like to call it Cadillac fishing! You just kick back and whack the fish!!
I see your point Multi and have had a similar feeling after 50 or so fish on a day. I have been on a few Sac drifts and I really view as it as a fun day with my mates and a sore arm from too many fish? is fun to experience once or twice?. It is is definately not hiking to some high altitude spot where no one has ever fished before but it does have a different appeal. I for one always ask the guides a bunch of questions and have learned heaps by watching how guides adjust tactics throughout the day. Also a few of my trips have been down the Trinity. I have only, as sad as this is to say, ever hooked a steelhead with a guide!!! Over the last 2 years (only been fishing for 3) I have put nearly 40 hard days of fishing for steelhead onvarious rivers, and I can truly say that while I will surely remeber my first "unguided" Steelie (if it ever happens!!!) I will never discount ones hooked with  a guide!!Â
-- Edited by AfricanAngler on Saturday 1st of October 2011 01:21:11 AM
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"Three-fourths of the Earth's surface is water, and one-fourth is land. It is quite clear that the good Lord intended us to spend triple the amount of time fishing as taking care of the lawn." - Anon.
When I fish with a guide, I KNOW I am going to catch, particularly if we are drifting the Lower Sac. In fact, I expect to land 20+ fish; 40+ fish if I have the boat to myself. And I know some of the fish will be as large as anything I have ever caught on a fly. So yes, I enjoy the experience, but I recognize that my success isn't entirely of my own volition. It isn't like a typical day when there is possibiity of a skunk, and so no thrill of the first few fish, now knowing that you are going to have a good day; the good day is assured.
I just put guided fishing in a different category, enjoy it for what it is, and try to learn something from the guide, which is similar to your whorehouse analogy. It may not be true love, and the uncertainty of whether you are going to get laid may not be present, but it can be fun doin' it with a "pro". Â
DJ Cal
-- Edited by DJ Cal on Saturday 1st of October 2011 06:36:44 AM
I guess the reason I posted this is that for me at some point it's not about just catching fish and I continue to question exactly why I like fishing. We didn't have an insanely great day like many of you mention. I fished at the back of the boat all day and landed 10, the biggest being 21". My friend in front was somewhat new to fly fishing so he caught maybe 3. The guide mentioned that the fishing had been slow the last few days.
 At the end I told the guide I thought I had more fun than if we'd been slamming them all day. Why? Even though the guide put on the flies, unhooked all the fish, tied all the rigs and pointed out where to cast, it was something of a challenge fishing at the back of the boat. I had to constantly look at the guy in the front so my indicator was covering a different lane and looking for situations where he had his fly out of productive water and then puting the fly there. Since there weren't a huge number of hookups, each one seemed to take on more value.
It seems like if it's too easy and same-old, same-old, it gets a little old for me. Which leads us back to....
I agree with all that has been said. I have been fishing for about 10-12 years and started out with a guide so I could learn easily with fewer bad habits to break later, as happened with my tennis (lesson-less) days prior. Since I fish new water at least once a year, I will usually take a guide for the first day to get clues as to some flies that will work and to learn where the fish are. All guides are forthcoming with other holes I might try on the following days w/o them. One thing I have found is that a good guide will almost always teach you something new, and I almost always come away with a new knot or line rigging method or improvement in casting technique. To that end, I have one guide in Mammoth who is always entertaining and usually teaches me something, although after 10 years with him on half-day trips now (cheaper and very discounted since we are friend-client now), I perhaps continue on as much to keep in touch as well as learning something about flyfishing or the local politics of water rights, etc he is involved in.
So, I agree with Multi that the "exploration component" of fly fishing is diminshed with a guide, but I submit the virtue of using guides occassionally to be a "continuing education" benefit that you will carry with you on the other non-guided trips during the year. And for new areas, it is the best way to see if the area is worth coming back to; because if you are exploring new areas and dont catch fish, sometimes you don't know if the problem is you or the fishery.
Finally, those of us who can afford these trips need to keep the guides alive. They are our best advocates for preserving the fisheries. And then of course there is the recession...but let's stay on fishing, not economics.
I concur about learning from guides. On the few occasions that I have been guided down the Lower Sac, our guide has pointed out fishy spots including where to wade. It was a great way to introduce my boys to the sport.
Learning aside however, sometimes it is nice to have more continual action than is typically available doing it myself (I'm speaking for myself here). I wonder if there is an element of feeling like it is too easy?! After all, our sport is DEFINED by self imposed limitations and the sense that we are giving the fish more of a chance not to be caught.
Dan
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). The guide drifts down the river in the best spots and all you have to do is mend your line occassionally and set the hook. It's close to a sure thing. The guide was excellent at managing the boat and directing us to the best spots. He took most of the difficulty out of fishing. I enjoyed the trip overall, but still have questions about a spoonfed fishing experience.
