Now grahler,  I am sure your aware of the back and forth bull $hit that goes on in this site.  If you didn't know, well it does because of lame a$$ COMMENTS LIKE YOURS.  You don't know me or how successfull I am on any water.  I was giving a tip on setting a hook.  Bobber fish if you want, but don't be such a Geek.

Arn't we all on the same team? Theres alot of ways to catch a fish grasshopper, my mentor said! Lets help each other be beter.

There is an ideal situation for every technique, and many times you are left with a less than ideal set of variables for which you have to choose the correct technique. It is ultimately up to the fisherman to read the water, determine where the fish are holding and use the method that best fits the situation. As with any art the more well versed you are in technique, the better prepared you will be to catch fish under various circumstances and conditions. In the end you assign your own limits. Keep an open mind.

Packrat said:

And you do like to stir it up don't you


Yeah, I do but I mean well Packrat. I think Chuck really put that very succintly. I must admit I get personally offended when folks are down on indicators no matter what. My main advantage to the indicator is that I don't have to wade within a rods length of the fish to have a chance. I can fish cross stream up or down (granted down stream nymphing is a presentation of last resort due to hookset difficulties) and I can fish this way wading less. I think that indicator nymphing is an art and I have seen less than 2% of fisherman really excel with it. 90% of fisherman have no clue what their fly is doing and they are using big indicators of all types so maybe some folks associate indicator with ignorance. I would like to break this trend of thought.
There are many advantages to both ways of presenting nymphs in different situations. IMO indicators are very versatile and I think MOST people who don't use them because they are not cool have given up on an important tool in their trout arsenal. They do not cause flies to be presented unnaturally in all situations by their very nature and I cannot stand folks that subscribe to this line of reasoning. Anyhow whatever I am starting to wish duck season was still open...

Alot of times I high stick or short line w/ my indicator still attached to the leader, but not in the water. It works just the same and gives me a reference point for how deep my nymphs are getting. Then when I work all the water in front of me I can extend my reach without changing a thing. But soon enough I will be able to say goodbye to the "bobber" and replace it with something much cooler that will catch fish and float my nymphs!! ;)

R u referring to Mike Wiers Hoppicator?  Its pretty cool.  

Haha... never fish the Carson without a big dry on!!! There is always a chance to get fish on one! Ok I'll bite, I have some Hoppicators I tied and another special little bug I like to call the Anticator! Pics are coming...

grahler wrote:

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My main advantage to the indicator is that I don't have to wade within a rods length of the fish to have a chance. I can fish cross stream up or down and I can fish this way wading less. I think that indicator nymphing is an art and I have seen less than 2% of fisherman really excel with it. 90% of fisherman have no clue what their fly is doing and they are using big indicators of all types so maybe some folks associate indicator with ignorance. 

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I'm the same boat as Grahler. I think indicators have their place much in the same way that Grahler says here. I personally like small indicators like a small piece of cork. I also like the idea of making indicators to look somewhat natural, like a small twig floating down the creek or something. The big indicators look goofy to me and I would assume hard to cast so I don't use them, but they work for people. I also like the the dry and dropper technique as I feel I am killing two birds with one stone by taking fish on either. Personally, I find it hard to stealthily high stick a run in a creek that is only a foot or foot in a half (I'm assuming that's how you nymph shallower creeks), so I use an indicator such as a dry fly or a hopper (love the hoppicator, going to try that out this season). However, there have been times when I opt out of using an indicator. For example, there was this one stretch of river I used to fish that had areas varying in depths from one foot to twelve or thirteen. I feel that I have more control through deeper runs when I don't use an indicator. My main goal is control and presentation. I'm still learning so I use what catches me fish.

Use what works for you though

Chuck good looking flies.

Am I seeing a piece of mono sticking out of the front and back end of those flies?

Yes, the mono loop is Mike Weir's invention. If you watch the video he demonstrates how it works. I really like the idea of weighting your flies as well drifter. While I was guiding in Idaho the standby we used pretty much all season on the South Fork was a chernobyl ant in various sizes and colors with a team of heavy tungsten flies dropped below. They never use indicators or split shot over there (at least not the lodge I worked for). I wish I had known about the Hoppicator because it would have been dynamite over there! I have not had a chance to test the new system yet but soon...

I had some steelhead whack my indicator this year, so I tied up some green butt skunkicators.  I didn't land anything on the dry, but I had a fish bump it. 

Chuck,
It looks like you've been busy at the vise.  Those flies look good.

Very pretty flies Chuck. Nice work.

Tie the fly. Drift the fly. Catch the trout. Repeat.

wow nice steelies! bet that buck put up one hell of a fight!